There's a short video clip of an interview with the Education Association of Cheshire union president Beverly Jurkiewicz on NHR's article of Thurday's budget vote.
76 comments:
Anonymous
said...
Scary to think she is teaching our children. Yes, the amount of salary that we are paying the teachers has not changed dramatically in the past 3 years. However, the amount of students that are being educated has dropped by 164 students (207 less in 4 years). We have lost teachers, I may be wrong, but I thought it was around 20, yet the total salaries remain similar. Yes, Ms. Jurkiewicz, the teachers high salaries over these past 3years has stifled spending in other areas. Programs will be cut, students parents will be charged extra if they are involved in athletics, a school may close. I'm sorry, but Cheshire does not have a bottomless pocket to keep your union members some of the highest paid teachers in the state, while also allowing the students all the added benefits that they once got. So, I would say that this last teacher's contract has played a large role in why we are in a mess right now. Open your eyes!!
She feels that we are targeting their union? Well, of course, her union is one of a few, if not the only one, that has not NOT had a raise in the last 6-9 years. Again, they are concerned about the kids suffering but they are unwilling to give up their raises for this year. Which, I could be off a little, would amount to a little over 1 million dollars!! i'm so sorry that she feels they are being persecuted!!!!!!!! We are paying higher taxes, implemented activity fees which are doomed to increase as well, and she wants us to feel sorry for her/them. I suspect its the leadership of the union once again not coming up with the concessions needed for the sake of our kids education, which is most important to them.
I spoke with a teacher at one of the BOE meetings and he told me it's the union leadership who will not make concessions. He said that the majority of the teachers would make concessions to save teaching positions.
"I spoke with a teacher at one of the BOE meetings and he told me it's the union leadership who will not make concessions. He said that the majority of the teachers would make concessions to save teaching positions." I don't know if that is true, but I do know that this current TC has not helped matters at all. The way they handled the budget last year and their threats this year are not exactly creating fertile ground for compromise. Quite the contrary.
"164 less students (3% drop) 30 less teachers (8% drop)"
Rainy day fund continues to grow. We spent millions on the pool with the burst bubble. The turf field project raised hundreds of thousands to supplement grant funds. We can't afford to fund the BOE budget? Hmmmm.
6:27 .."their threats this year." Please be specific who made a threat and what exactly they said.
The pool - yes it cost a small fortune but some group of pool supporters claimed it wouldn't cost the town anything b/c user fees, etc would cover it.
"The turf field project raised hundreds of thousands to supplement grant funds." The sports groups were the ones who pushed this through and besides the taxpayer dollars of $525K from the State, the rest is supposedly being paid through donations.
hmmm...donations...maybe the turf heads are on to something.
4:24, "if that's the case then the union membership can petition for the concession" Couldn't agree with you more.
"I would not expect much more at this point but if the BOE is lacking the intestinal fortitude to reduce the requested increase there will be a reduction forthcoming from the Town Council."
This TC has been the roadblock that's preventing the union from helping with concessions. Hopefully that road block will be obliterated this coming Nov.
10:21 & 10:48 Not sure if I consider that a threat. Let me ask you this - Can you tell me of any R or D council or TM that has not reduced the Superintendents proposed budget?
"10:21 & 10:48 Not sure if I consider that a threat. Let me ask you this - Can you tell me of any R or D council or TM that has not reduced the Superintendents proposed budget?" It's all in how much is cut and how willing the TC is willing to compromise. Last year the TC cut more than usual, showed absolutely no interest in compromise, and saw no downside in the resulting layoffs. If you think the promise of "more of the same" is not a threat to those who will be laid-off then you need to think again.
TPS: You just don't get it. You want the union to agree to concessions and then wait to see if this TC reciprocates by providing more funding to the BOE. Is last years' decisions their EVIDENCE that this TC is willing to fund the BOE at a reasonable level? How about a different tack this year? Why not first promise to use some of the rainy day fund to get the town through the last year of the contract as a sign of compromise?
Was last years' budget a "success"? Although tax inncreases were kept to a minimum, the rainy day fund remained oversized, and there was more layoffs and more kids crammed into classrooms. If that is what the TC feels they were elected to accomplish then we really need to get out and VOTE to put a stop to that.
Cheshire's drama program appears alive and well. Kids are NOT crammed into classrooms. Classrooms may be at capacity but certainly not crammed. Stop embellishing class size...you make it appear as if they're being treated like veal.
Back to the topic at hand. So, if teachers are truly encouraging a concession why don't they start a petition amongst the membership?
I think this is logical but simply not practical because signing the petition (essentially voting no confidence in the union leadership) could lead to retaliation on behalf of the union leadership and/or members opposed to concessions.
Yes, it may sound 'horrible' but remember this union leadership has demonstrated they'd rather eat their young (so to speak) i.e. 30 layoffs over 2 years for the greater good of the tenured members.
Has any Town Council ever approved the Town Manager's Town budget as submitted to them? Would a single member of the community expect elected officials to simply rubber stamp budgets? The answer is absolutely NOT.
Much credit is deserving of Dr. Greg Florio and Michael Milone for doing their part in developing budgets and directing the towns depts. They are great managers but they have a board of directors. The elected board of directors represents stackholders, you the taxpayers and residents of Cheshire.
When civil society decides we should be rubber stamping budgets without the oversite of elected representitives what will they be willing to give up next?
I'm sorry that some of you are of a mind that the Town Council is at fault for the teachers union making no concessions. That is simply misplaced responsibility.
The teacher's union has stood by this fact; they bargained in good faith and got a three year contract the town agreed to. And you know what, they are accurate in their assessment but a contract award does not guaranty the town can fund everything as is.
Concessions may simply bring about preserving the number of teachers in our schools and since this seems to be the most vocal concern I think all of us would have to agree that a combination of modest tax increases and concessions would go a long way preserving the level of teachers we have now.
I have publically invited (thurs 1/27/11)the union leadership to talk to me, Gerry Brittingham, Dr Florio and any other member of the community they would like to.
My offer stands and I would invite all of you to join me in encouraging this dialogue.
"Concessions may simply bring about preserving the number of teachers in our schools and since this seems to be the most vocal concern I think all of us would have to agree that a combination of modest tax increases and concessions would go a long way preserving the level of teachers we have now." By refusing to consider the rainy day fund as an option that will reduce tax increases and layoffs, you are ignoring a large portion of your constituency and creating a roadblock to compromise. Are you listening to that or is it something that you just don't want to hear?
"I'm sorry that some of you are of a mind that the Town Council is at fault for the teachers union making no concessions. That is simply misplaced responsibility." I'm sorry that you think this is a one sided problem. Just because you believe that doesn't make it so. The taxpayers are caught in the middle. Compromise requires departure from old beliefs. If you can't do that then retire and let somebody reasonable take your place.
"Yes, it may sound 'horrible' but remember this union leadership has demonstrated they'd rather eat their young (so to speak) i.e. 30 layoffs over 2 years for the greater good of the tenured members." Rhetoric like this is not helping the process. If you really think the union "wants" layoffs, then compromise is hopeless. If you think that they want to discuss other options besides tax increases then that's a start.
At the end of a budget year there usually is a fund balance / "surplus". One source can be tax revenue which is budgeted at a 99% collection rate but the town usually collects 99.6 or higher. In years past we were actually getting additional and unexpected revenue from the state. Fund balance become operating revenue for the next budget year and thus cushions the impact of a tax increase.
This year the town manager has frozen some capital projects based on some expected short fall in revenues. The same thing took place last year. TC was informed last month that the state funded cheshire 183K less than expected on the personal property exemeption granted local business by state mandate. The state is supposed to fund that difference but we all know the state is up against the wall and similar cuts are likely in many other state funding sources.
The rainy day fund is about 1 months operating revenue for the town. The level has been about 9% for the past few years. The level of these reserves impacts the town's bond rating which reduces the interest rate we pay on our borrowing. It is not walking around money either.
We have become accustomed to the notion of deficit spending for years now with the state and federal gov't but Cheshire has been managed by both Democrat and Republican Councils that have supported keeping our Cheshire's house in sound finacial order. And most of the credit goes to our taxpayers.
The rainy day fund can be reviewed by the TC and this does take place about every 3 years. The last Council supported a 9% level. Last year $600K was used from the fund to support the budget. Cutting into the Rainy day fund is not as wise as it may seem as it is a one time revenue source that makes the following years hole even harder to fill.
When I suggested compromise vis a vis concessions I was not suggesting that TC would not be looking at all sorts of funding opportunities and cost cutting measures.
At the 2/8 meeting of the TC I have asked the budget chairman and Michael Milone to apprise the council and the public of the status rainy day fund. Based on a recent audit just reported we will have the amount of the current fund balance.
Thanks, Tim, for clarifying things. People here tend to assume an awful lot when they make statements about the boe & tc and who's going to fund what. Keep up the good work! I know you have the best interest of the entire community in mind during the budget process.
Tim S, thanks for posting and I hope you continue to post here as you see fit. I don't agree with the criticism that you, nor anybody else on the TC, is preventing the union from negotiating concessions.
I don't think most folks realize that Tim Slocum is part of talks with the union leadership along with Dr. Florio and Gerry Brittingham. I believe Tim has played a very positive role in this team.
While Tim & I may differ on various topics I do respect Tim and know that he's more than fair...certainly more than some folks may want to admit.
In the end...I just want to remind folks that it's not about Tim Slocum, the TC or the BOE. Both of these elected bodies are trying to educate the town about our finances and dire circumstances associated with either increasing or decreasing already tight budgets in this economy in a state with a $3.75B budget deficit.
I hope that folks will put aside their grievances, if only for a moment, to listen in on the upcoming budget meetings between the TC and BOE. I feel that too many of the important details become lost under the cloud of disdain for either of the elected bodies or individuals contained therein.
Getting back on topic here...I posted this thread because we often don't get to hear from the union leadership. As such, I welcome the union leadership to post here as they see fit.
We've begun scheduling meetings with the Finance/Planning committees to analyze areas of reductions and prepare for a $2M reduction in the budget proposal. Layoffs will be on the table.
In short, the boe is not waiting for superman, or superwoman in this case :-) though should he/she arrive it would be greatly appreciated by many in Cheshire.
Again, when was the last time the teachers did not get a raise? Just because you don't like the way the TC or Boe or whomever talks does not validate the Union not coming forth with an offer of concession. SOMEONE needs to take the first step, and seeing how generous this Town has been in awarding contracted wage increases year after year, it should be the UNION. Many people who still have jobs in this economy DESERVE as raise, or a larger raise than the 1% or $1 an hour they may have gotten, but most are thankful, for the most part, to still be employed. Someone mentioned that the TC or BOE member(s) are not necessarily listening to their constituents. Well, is the Union leadership listening to theirs? i had conversations with several teachers LAST year who said they were willing to FOREGO raises if it helped to save some of the teaching positions.
I believe every other bargaining unit in this town has made monetary concessions to help out, whether to save fellow workers jobs or reduce the likelihood of layoff. Why is this one the only one that has not? Did the other bargaining units NOT negotiate in good faith? Is it just everyone else who has to pitch in during these budget times but not the teachers?
Honestly, if they don't step up again this year, I hope that our TC and BOE are very diligent and judicious during the next contract negotiations and make sure that there are ZERO increase years and minimal increase years moving forward.
"When I suggested compromise vis a vis concessions I was not suggesting that TC would not be looking at all sorts of funding opportunities and cost cutting measures.
At the 2/8 meeting of the TC I have asked the budget chairman and Michael Milone to apprise the council and the public of the status rainy day fund. Based on a recent audit just reported we will have the amount of the current fund balance." Tim Slocum
So Tim are you saying that you would consider using a reasonable portion of the RDF to fund the BOE budget, because that is real progress if so. There are some on the TC who clearly won't even consider it.
agreed in 2008 actual 2008 $27,628,012 $27,628,012 2009 $28,843,645 $27,546,647 2010 $30,112,765 $27,646,762 2011 $31,437,727 ??????
Teacher salaries are NOT the problem. By choice, the town has not yet funded ANY of the agreed to salary increases since the teacher contract was negotiated. That is their choice.
If the TC "generously" approved Dr. Florio's budget which includes a $1m increase to teacher salaries for next year, that wouldn't even be what was promised 2 years ago.
Much credit is deserving of Dr. Greg Florio and Michael Milone for doing their part in developing budgets and directing the towns depts. They are great managers
On the "great manager" part, I strongly disagree about MM. It's not just ignoring the issues at the PD and PW for the past few years. Fundamentally, those were personnel issues.
Let's discuss financial issues... supposedly his strength.
Look at the recent arbitration decision that eliminated DB plans for future library union employees. That decision was almost certainly based in part on the "precedent" that had been set when the Council -- against vehement opposition by MM -- voted to direct the TM to eliminate DB plans for future non-union employees.
Eliminating DB plans is the "big picture" stuff. It's not wasting money on some mismanaged PW project.
I'm not saying he's a terrible manager, but "great" is an overstatement IMO. We can do better.
" I don't agree with the criticism that you, nor anybody else on the TC, is preventing the union from negotiating concessions." Regardless of what Tim or any other TC member says, they had the option last year to provide more funds to the BOE without raising taxes any more than they did and chose not to. If you think that has no bearing on this year you are mistaken. What is the union to assume, that TC will change their tune if concessions happen. Has the TC done anything to change the impasse? As a concerned parent I have been listening and heard nothing from them. The teachers made an offer of a no interest loan last year. Granted it was not what the BOE wanted, but it was still something. This year >100 teachers moved to the HSA to try and save the BOE some benefits costs. Still the rhetoric continues that they have done "nothing". Compromise is not a one way street.
The ink was not even dry on the CUTS to the education budget last year and this TC payed for a special vote (which costs thousands) on a new $7,000,000 pool cover.
It'll $5.0 billion after Gov. Malloy implements honest GAAP accounting... something The Fraudsters in Hartford have been avoiding for years. Thank you Chris Donovan!
Tony, I know that you are not a big fan of stats on "per pupil spending". I know I have read on here somewhere that you believe that spending more may not necessarily improve a students education. Many people would argue that point, but I won't do that now.
I would argue, however, that the numbers here DO, unquestionably support the fact that Cheshire taxpayers are not getting "hosed" on education costs. I think these numbers show they get tremendous value.
"I know that you are not a big fan of stats on "per pupil spending". I know I have read on here somewhere that you believe that spending more may not necessarily improve a students education. Many people would argue that point, but I won't do that now."
The problem I have with the per pupil spending report is how Dr. Florio uses it. The report wasn't meant to rank school districts because every DRG group is unique and ranking them is like comparing apples to oranges and pomengranates. But I feel he uses that report as a crutch to highlight how "little" Cheshire is spending on education to bolster his budget requests. And, it plays on the emotions of those that believe we can't spend enough on students. But...I'm very happy where we 'rank' on that list because spending in the top 15% doesn't prove that more spending equates to better test results. Spending is just one factor. And the ranking is nothing more than download the spreadsheet and sorting from highest-lowest on PPS. Wow.
I DO NOT want to be #1 on that list. Great example of spending considerably on students with poor test results.
I haven't ripped into the per pupil spending yet (it's on my to do list) and I'm waiting for the CEDaR system to be updated with 2009-2010 data on PPS.
I do think the statistic has a useful purpose. I think you posted a partial link as I can't see the report you posted.
Schrumm said the town’s budget would be built around a tax increase that residents could afford and said a 1.7 percent increase could be expected. this from the record journal Seems as though boss schrumm has already made up the minds of the 7 members He knows better than anyone So input not needed
"The teachers made a good concession offer last year". EXCUSE ME! A loan to be paid back later is a concession? Try that with your boss and he'll laugh in your face before he throws you out.
Over 70% of Cheshires budget is for education. How can people say we don't spend ENOUGH for education? Most of the BOE and TC members have attended or had children in the school system and they still live here. I believe they all are aware of the importance of education. To keep on saying they don't care is false. Call them and talk to them, I'm sure you will be educated.
4:41 I hate to say this but I must. You are a dope.
The pool user fees paid by the district is in the Ed budget. I must agree that classifying it as revenue in the pool budget sounds crazy but the pool has a dedicated budget that identifies expenses and revenues...and operates at a loss. (so does the Ed district but who cares about that)
The TC doesn't keep money from the district that is for the district although maybe they should set up an account for "found money" so you can tell them how to spend it.
Did you ever notice that your taxes are paid to the town of Cheshire? They are not paid to the TC or the BOE.
I know you are way too smart to get this and the TC is very coniving and evil but thats the way it is in your cold igloo...or is it a hot air balloon?
"Did you ever notice that your taxes are paid to the town of Cheshire? They are not paid to the TC or the BOE." I sure as heck did notice. It's hard not to when you read that Cheshire Herald article about where that >$1 million surplus in tax money went (see post above). $450,000 to the medical trust fund, $600,000 to next years budget, $80,000 to the RDF, and $0 to the BOE. Yes, that's right $0. Maybe Schrumm decided that this was a concession by proxy.
How educational! The only town that has schools close to our quality is Bethany (Amity School District) and they are #1 on the list in spending. This TC would rather that we resemble the bottom 3 in the quality of education. How about the property values and crime to match?
7:34 Did you know that if the Boe has extra money at the end of their budget cycle (like from the salary acct.) that money didn't go back to the town, instead it goes into the medical trust fund account.
The budgets are complicated for most of us to understand (and I've followed them for a while). With all the boe year-end transfers, it's amazing anyone on the boe even knows exactly where the money went. Creative accounting at its best. :)
All those towns spend more than we do on education? Oh my Dorothy, we're not in Kansas anymore. Better not tell the TC member behind the curtain. He might not grant the BOE more funding.
Tony: I'm not sure why you are asking, after all you're the one on the BOE. You should know this. You can choose any number of criteria: CMT/CAPT scores, SAT scores, % of students that attend college. Pick any or all of those and all of those schools are "good". Cheshire is comparable to all of those schools and ranks well above every district surrounding it.
If the teachers refuse to make concessions...the loan is not a concession...either are the HSAs...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions? nxt yr isnt going to any better than this yr, probably worse...why are other towns cutting teachers?
"...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions?" Was last years' TC budget decisions what you call "bending"? From my perspective as a parent and taxpayer, I would call it INSULTING. This TC refuses to listen to parents. We don't want the RDF at 9% and we don't want further layoffs.
"...the loan is not a concession...either are the HSAs...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions? " No those were not the 0% raise concessions that some on the TC were looking for, but they were an honest effort to help the BOE with a funding gap. Of course, the funding gap for the BOE can be affected greatly by the TC. Last year the TC specifically provided funding to the BOE to cover only increases in transportation and utilities costs. Nothing for salaries. Now the TC is calling on the union to do more to help, but offering nothing but rhetoric in return. Is that really helping the situation?
Tell me what the TC is going to offer other than a tax increase? the town only has so much money, where is it going to come from other than taxes? My children have been in the school system and we notice no decrease in services do to any cuts in the budget. They are avg students taking regular classes and participating in sports/activities. parking has increased and participation fee has increased...why dont we take a collection? When my kid was in Norton we donated funds to help buy Smart boards....maybe when people get up to argue against a leaner budget, we can put a donation table at the mic and you can drop a check/cash in...
Tony, Have you ever looked at hiring a private company to mow,plow and clean the schools? Alsoo a private firm to run the lunches??? Every time I see a town employee weeding flower beds I can't help but think it is a total waste of money knowing they are making union wages.
FYI There already is a private company that cleans the schools. They used to do it everyday now it's every other day and boy can you see the difference. Yuck.
FYI The lunch program is NOT part of the Boe budget. They're a self supporting program.
"Tell me what the TC is going to offer other than a tax increase?" Have you read any of the other posts? To use part of the oversized rainy day fund!!! That would get us through this year. Next year will be a new contract.
"My children have been in the school system and we notice no decrease in services do to any cuts in the budget." I don't know what school your children go to, but all of the schools have increased class sizes. Also, there are less course offerings at the high school.
"Have you ever looked at hiring a private company to mow,plow and clean the schools? Alsoo a private firm to run the lunches??? Every time I see a town employee weeding flower beds I can't help but think it is a total waste of money knowing they are making union wages."
Regarding the school lunch programs it subsidized by the feds. There's a subsidy the schools receive for each lunch sold to students. It doesn't hit our operating budget. Capital items such as kitchen equipment and expansion is paid for by Cheshire in the seperate capital budget.
As for maintenance, we can certainly look into private firms however I first want to study the feasibility of combining both Town and BOE maintenance departments. I have to believe we can consolidate the two departments into a shared town service. When I last asked the Superintendent about this, his response was that both he and Town Manager were working on this but Michael Milone put it on the back burner to handle other priorities.
I think that the BOE/Administration should not be focusing on maintenance of our buildings and grounds. I'd like to see a study completed on whether or not it makes sense to combine the two departments once and for all. This may or may not save us money but I have to believe that by centralizing the function on the town side would yield a more efficient operation and a cohesive maintenance strategy for our aging school buildings. That's not to say that either the BOE and Town maintenance operations are not doing a great job but it seems redundant to me.
"maybe when people get up to argue against a leaner budget, we can put a donation table at the mic and you can drop a check/cash in"
I would gladly donate if the TC would agree to use some of the RDF for the BOE. Their insistance that the RDF is only for catastrophes is ridiculous and pompous.
"I don't know what school your children go to, but all of the schools have increased class sizes."
I'm going to chime in on this because I have two daughters at Highland, 1st and 3rd grades and I spend a lot of time at Highland and Dodd. My daughters are not "suffering" from increased class sizes. The classrooms at Highland are not packed to the gills. All of our administrators have done their best to shift teachers around so that those capable can handle larger class sizes, where applicable. Our teachers also benefit from parent volunteers as they see fit. I believe Highland has found a great balance with increased class sizes and support for those classes. Students are not suffering at Highland, the district's largest elementary school.
But...as I've noted here before, physical classroom space is at/near capacity. We can no longer make wholesale classroom consolidations. If classes are increased, we have to be precise about how many students can be placed in the limited classroom space let alone the feasibility of doing so.
Since the start of this school year, the BOE has received zero complaints about class sizes. Not a single parent wrote or contacted the BOE to raise issues about their children "suffering" due to increased class sizes. Prior to the budget meetings, nobody came to committee or BOE meetings to raise issues with classroom sizes. We have not heard from a single teacher, principal or administrator on this matter until this budget process.
And we receive weekly, sometimes daily updates from the administration and all BOE members are keeping an eye on class sizes. To the best of my knowledge, the administration received one complaint from parents about Norton school regarding two classes that increased in size. Working with the administration, Dr. Florio met with those parents at the beginning of the school year to address their concerns. The two classrooms were staffed with teachers more than capable of handling the larger classes.
Now, I'm not stating that no news is good news but rather no news is just that...no news. But if the students are truly "suffering" as a few have indicated then the teachers, principals, administrators and BOE needs to know about it and I encourage those parents who believe their children are indeed suffering from larger classes to contact their principals ASAP and not to wait for budget season to raise the issue.
"Also, there are less course offerings at the high school."
Well, we didn't eliminate electives at CHS last year or the previous year as I recall. So I don't believe fewer course offerings are a result of teacher layoffs since all of the teacher layoffs so far ('09/'10) were done at the elementary and middle schools. I believe we eliminated an advanced language course this year because of the very low enrollment.
Looking at the CHS Master Schedule, there are plenty of course offerings available and it appears there's space available, to some degree, in most of them. What I do notice, however, is a large number of study halls. Study halls are indeed needed for their intended purpose. But I would encourage those students to enroll into additional mathematics, science, reading/literature courses over a study hall if some other course they're interested in is full or no longer available. I have heard from a few students who believe study halls are being used, by some, to pass the time but I hope that's the exception, not the rule.
I'm going to be discussing the CHS Master Schedule here over the next two weeks and I will publish stats on our offerings, class sizes and study halls. Stay tuned.
"Tony: I'm not sure why you are asking, after all you're the one on the BOE. You should know this."
I do but I hear various definitions for "good schools" and they range from course offerings, test results, spending, athletics, class sizes, "quality" of education and property values to name a few.
If basing it on CAPT/CMT test scores, I can tell you that being #1 on the Per Pupil Spending report does not guarantee top scoring on testing. In fact, it would appear to be the opposite.
While I'm glad to see outstanding CAPT/CMT scoring by our school district...I'm not fully convinced those tests are the end all, be all definition of "good schools". I have to consider quality and variety of curriculum offered, graduation and drop-out rates and what I call the "fluff" factor regarding curriculum.
Are some school districts padding their curriculum with "core" courses intended to help students meet minimal credit and graduation requirements but short-changing them on actual content? I consider this "fluff" courses.
Let's take science for example. That State has a mandate on science credits. I think that's wonderful. The first thought that comes to mind is Chemistry, Biology, Physics. But is Zoology considered a true, core science course or simply something that helps students meet a credit? Zoology was raised to me by a few parents which is why I'm using it as an example. Some believe it's a "fluff" course.
While I've been focused on planning/finance so far on the BOE, I've also been looking into curriculum. I will be posting some topics on curriculum soon, specifically mathematics. I'm finding that finding/spending enough time to write up all of the posts I want is challenging but eventually will happen. Be patient. :-)
"My daughters are not "suffering" from increased class sizes. The classrooms at Highland are not packed to the gills." Tony: Do they have to be packed to th gills in order for us to measure suffering? Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?
"Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?"
February 5, 2011 5:16 PM
I agree with 9:34 - 2 more kids is nothing - 10 more, well that's another story.
It's interesting how some here are ripping into the TC. Do they realize last year it was the Boe that cut 1.1 million out of Florio's budget? I don't hear you saying you should vote them all out.
Instead of complaining about class size now(and as Tony said no one complained all year) why don't you come up with some budget saving solutions.
As for maintenance, we can certainly look into private firms however I first want to study the feasibility of combining both Town and BOE maintenance departments. I have to believe we can consolidate the two departments into a shared town service. When I last asked the Superintendent about this, his response was that both he and Town Manager were working on this but Michael Milone put it on the back burner to handle other priorities.
Tony, I think this is a very important point you raise. Here's my take as to what's actually happening...
As I stated a year ago during the campaign, the Council needs to deal with the DPWs failed management. Unfortunately for the taxpayers, the TM refuses to do anything about dealing with this situation... the Council has not taken any substantive action with the TM… and the taxpayers continue getting fleeced through waste and mismanagement. (Look no further than Rosemary Lane.)
Instead of appointing management that could handle your request, MM does his usual "back burner" routine… deny, defer, delay. The TM knows that the current DPW cannot capably handle your request. And so, it becomes a waiting game… waiting until you forget your request.
I assure you that absolutely nothing will change until the BOE – not GF – forcefully pushes on this. But GFs overall relationship with MM is more important to him than this particular issue. So GF will not forcefully push on this. He will not rock the boat on this one… until directed to do so. Then he can go to MM and say the BOE made him do it.
Also, you could talk to Council members about this and try to get them to direct the TM to engage GF. But based on my experience, nothing will change because this issue relates to one of the TMs most “sensitive” personnel situations. MM will pushback on the Council and they won't act.
I suggest a BOE motion directing the Sptd to officially request a deadline for action (with benchmarks) from the TM. Then perhaps the Council will do likewise with the TM. From a policy perspective, that puts you on the record and the ball is in the Council’s court.
The Council may, or may not, get involved. But I wouldn’t let this one slip by and just get ignored indefinitely. The issues related to this request get to the heart of whether the town has capable management… so it will be avoided by the TM at all costs.
But keep this in mind… what’s the endgame? If your goal is to transfer facilities management to the Town, then you should be comfortable with the facilities management team. If you are, that's your opinion. But I’m not comfortable with it. So I suggest simultaneous conversations on:
1) the facilities management team org chart… and
2) who should fill the org chart.
Perhaps with a realigned facilities management team, the org chart will need to change. And things may work out great. Come to think of it… such an idea may spur the Council to action.
Also, you may want to ask GF for MMs “other priorities.” I recall hearing MM publicly state several times that he and GF were working collaboratively to save money through economies of scale. And if that’s true, then this should at least be fairly high on his radar, if not a top priority… right?
Or maybe I’m wrong. But I doubt it. So I encourage you to use your seat at the table to require action is taken in a timely manner. Then let others publicly explain the “other priorities.”
"Or maybe I’m wrong. But I doubt it. So I encourage you to use your seat at the table to require action is taken in a timely manner. Then let others publicly explain the “other priorities.”
Somehow I knew you'd chime in on this :-). I hear you and I will follow through on this.
"It's interesting how some here are ripping into the TC. Do they realize last year it was the Boe that cut 1.1 million out of Florio's budget? I don't hear you saying you should vote them all out."
I heard it last year and had the blog been live last Feb I'm certain there would be many posts against the BOE reduction. During the last budget cycle we were able to identify specific reductions early on in the process. I voted to reduce the budget last year by just under $1M.
However, our options are not so clear cut this time around. Classroom space is at a premium, enrollment is not dropping as quickly as projected and we have contractual/mandated obligations to meet. Reductions must be precise and yes it's that tight and deserves proper due diligence.
The BOE finance committee is meeting on a regular basis between now and June to review specific areas of reduction. Next week (I'll post the meeting reminder tomorrow) the BOE Finance Committee is meeting to discuss costs associated with extra-curricular activities. It's very possible we may see a full pay to play participation fee. With almost $1M being directed to extra-curricular activities, it's one area we're closely studying.
While the BOE was not able to make specific budget reduction recommendations last month...we will be making recommendations soon. It's not over for the BOE by any means.
People have been thanking me for passing Dr. Florio's budget (some are folks that chastized me for reducing it last year) I've asked them NOT to thank me because we will be making precise reduction recommendation soon, not arbitrary ones. I have to balance what I believe are the needs of the school district with fiscal responsibility. Some folks understand this, some don't.
Had the BOE been able to identify reductions to the budget, I'm certain we would have heard the complaints and 'bashing' that the TC seems to be receiving. I'm certain we will come this May.
What's being lost in the 'bashing' are the fiscal issues we're having both at the local and state levels as well as the looming reduction in grant money to Cheshire. The problems don't end with this current budget process be it hitting the rainy day fund and/or raising taxes. We will be in a similar situation next year, perhaps a less-dire situation if we can work out a concession with the teacher's union.
Don't bash the TC or the BOE, it's not going to solve for root cause, IMO.
"Tony: Do they have to be packed to th gills in order for us to measure suffering? Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?"
Are we headed in the wrong direction? Yes. I agree with you that one-on-one face time between teacher/student will decrease as class sizes grow. But that also depends on the makeup of the students in a class. Some require more attention than others and vice-versa. There are ways to offset that (naturally, by lowering class sizes) but also by provding help to the teachers. Be it IAT's or TA's and/or altering the curriculum to allow for more one-one time with students. Or, gasp, investment in technology to aid with curriculum delivery and student learning.
I do believe, however, that as our enrollment drops significantly over the next 5 years, we may see 'normal' class sizes again.
I disagree with you that it's this town council's fault for the wrong direction. Now, just because I'm an (R) and the majority on the TC is (R) doesn't mean I'm defending my 'kind' for the sake of politics. We don't always see eye to eye and I can be a giant pain in the rear to my fellow colleagues. But I don't believe anyone on the TC is anti-education and is not listening to the BOE, you or Dr. Florio or purposely leading us in the wrong direction on education.
What about the last TC? Or the prior one? Or the last 2,3 or 4 BOE's? What about our economic climate? $3.5B state deficit and $400M ECS shortfall? Sky rocketing health care costs and contractual obligations straining our wallets in this economy? Unemployment? Old school buildings whereby we invest millions of capital dollars every year for upkeep?
The list of "who's to blame" factors are extensive but I don't think it's fair to blame this particular TC. I think they've inherited an awful economy and are trying to navigate us through it.
And...Cheshire is certainly not alone in reducing budget requests including education. Every school district is facing the same similar issues as Cheshire but I believe we're much better off than most of them and can make our budget work to meet the needs of our school district.
Thanks Tony. I know your goal is to save money for the taxpayers. And many elected / appointed officials share your goal. The problem is that saving money is not necessarily the top priority for others.
IMO that's one of the most important things you can do as an elected official... learn what motivates other decisionmakers... not what they publicly state motivates them... but what actually motivates them. Such knowledge can greatly expedite the legislative process.
"I would gladly donate if the TC would agree to use some of the RDF for the BOE.
Money from the RDF is used in the budget. How much should they use for the BOE? And how much are you going to donate?" The TC and the TM have not done the budget yet. If the TC will use $1 million from the RDF for the BOE, I will donate $1000. With 30,000 residents, that would cover about 30 people or 10 families of 3. You can use the money to subsidize taxes for low income residents.
"During the last budget cycle we were able to identify specific reductions early on in the process. I voted to reduce the budget last year by just under $1M." Was the thought that this would avoid further reductions? It did not work out that way. This TC cut even further, hence the bashing.
"But I don't believe anyone on the TC is anti-education and is not listening to the BOE, you or Dr. Florio or purposely leading us in the wrong direction on education."
You may believe that Tony, but their actions speak volumes to the contrary. There are a lot of people who were very dissappointed in the TC budget decisions last year and in where they appear to be leaning this year. They are hurting the town in the long run in the name of what they think is "fiscal responsibility", but is really reactionary short-sighted thinking.
As a point of reference, as someone who has "negotiated" with the town. This is how it occurs... The personnel manager walks in, says this (lets say 2%) is what you have to work with. figure out what you want to add and give back, but thats it(not much of a negotaiation more of a dictation). THis goes back and forth, then mediation or arbitration goes on. The Town fails to compare themselves to like towns, chosing to compare to less affluent towns to better make thier case(as opposed to when they compare adminstator salaries. The mediator hands down a "fair" award then the TC complains, failing to recognize that mediated/arbitrated awards normally favor the municipality. They fail to vote thus invoking the award or a close vote is taken to have an appearance of due dilligence. Then Schrumm complains about arbitrations and Sima votes no to a favorable award. Employees unhappy, taxpayers unhappy, Cheshire becomes poorer (not financially, but standard of living). The town still posts surplus every year (1/2 mil each of last 2, 2 mil for each of previous 3 years) penny wise pound foolish
Tony, is it true that the teachers have called for a special meeting with the leadership to dicuss concessions? I have heard from a from a few teachers that most members are fed up with the executive board and want to offer concessions. If this meeting is happening, is it open to the public?
76 comments:
Scary to think she is teaching our children.
Yes, the amount of salary that we are paying the teachers has not changed dramatically in the past 3 years. However, the amount of students that are being educated has dropped by 164 students (207 less in 4 years).
We have lost teachers, I may be wrong, but I thought it was around 20, yet the total salaries remain similar.
Yes, Ms. Jurkiewicz, the teachers high salaries over these past 3years has stifled spending in other areas. Programs will be cut, students parents will be charged extra if they are involved in athletics, a school may close. I'm sorry, but Cheshire does not have a bottomless pocket to keep your union members some of the highest paid teachers in the state, while also allowing the students all the added benefits that they once got.
So, I would say that this last teacher's contract has played a large role in why we are in a mess right now.
Open your eyes!!
She feels that we are targeting their union? Well, of course, her union is one of a few, if not the only one, that has not NOT had a raise in the last 6-9 years. Again, they are concerned about the kids suffering but they are unwilling to give up their raises for this year. Which, I could be off a little, would amount to a little over 1 million dollars!! i'm so sorry that she feels they are being persecuted!!!!!!!! We are paying higher taxes, implemented activity fees which are doomed to increase as well, and she wants us to feel sorry for her/them. I suspect its the leadership of the union once again not coming up with the concessions needed for the sake of our kids education, which is most important to them.
I spoke with a teacher at one of the BOE meetings and he told me it's the union leadership who will not make concessions. He said that the majority of the teachers would make concessions to save teaching positions.
4:24, if that's the case then the union membership can petition for the concession.
"I spoke with a teacher at one of the BOE meetings and he told me it's the union leadership who will not make concessions. He said that the majority of the teachers would make concessions to save teaching positions."
I don't know if that is true, but I do know that this current TC has not helped matters at all. The way they handled the budget last year and their threats this year are not exactly creating fertile ground for compromise. Quite the contrary.
164 less students (3% drop)
30 less teachers (8% drop)
"164 less students (3% drop)
30 less teachers (8% drop)"
Rainy day fund continues to grow.
We spent millions on the pool with the burst bubble.
The turf field project raised hundreds of thousands to supplement grant funds.
We can't afford to fund the BOE budget? Hmmmm.
6:27 .."their threats this year." Please be specific who made a threat and what exactly they said.
The pool - yes it cost a small fortune but some group of pool supporters claimed it wouldn't cost the town anything b/c user fees, etc would cover it.
"The turf field project raised hundreds of thousands to supplement grant funds." The sports groups were the ones who pushed this through and besides the taxpayer dollars of $525K from the State, the rest is supposedly being paid through donations.
hmmm...donations...maybe the turf heads are on to something.
4:24, "if that's the case then the union membership can petition for the concession"
Couldn't agree with you more.
their threats this year." Please be specific who made a threat and what exactly they said.
"Good luck BOE. Educating our kids is your highest priority. After that its a bit muddy. Fewer dollars should be very clarifying.
TPS (Tim Slocum)
A not so veiled threat of more cuts to the BOE budget and more layoffs. Very diplomatic.
Yet another threat from TPS:
"I would not expect much more at this point but if the BOE is lacking the intestinal fortitude to reduce the requested increase there will be a reduction forthcoming from the Town Council."
This TC has been the roadblock that's preventing the union from helping with concessions. Hopefully that road block will be obliterated this coming Nov.
10:21 & 10:48 Not sure if I consider that a threat. Let me ask you this - Can you tell me of any R or D council or TM that has not reduced the Superintendents proposed budget?
"10:21 & 10:48 Not sure if I consider that a threat. Let me ask you this - Can you tell me of any R or D council or TM that has not reduced the Superintendents proposed budget?"
It's all in how much is cut and how willing the TC is willing to compromise. Last year the TC cut more than usual, showed absolutely no interest in compromise, and saw no downside in the resulting layoffs. If you think the promise of "more of the same" is not a threat to those who will be laid-off then you need to think again.
TPS: You just don't get it. You want the union to agree to concessions and then wait to see if this TC reciprocates by providing more funding to the BOE. Is last years' decisions their EVIDENCE that this TC is willing to fund the BOE at a reasonable level? How about a different tack this year? Why not first promise to use some of the rainy day fund to get the town through the last year of the contract as a sign of compromise?
Was last years' budget a "success"? Although tax inncreases were kept to a minimum, the rainy day fund remained oversized, and there was more layoffs and more kids crammed into classrooms. If that is what the TC feels they were elected to accomplish then we really need to get out and VOTE to put a stop to that.
"...and more kids crammed into classrooms."
Cheshire's drama program appears alive and well. Kids are NOT crammed into classrooms. Classrooms may be at capacity but certainly not crammed. Stop embellishing class size...you make it appear as if they're being treated like veal.
Back to the topic at hand. So, if teachers are truly encouraging a concession why don't they start a petition amongst the membership?
I think this is logical but simply not practical because signing the petition (essentially voting no confidence in the union leadership) could lead to retaliation on behalf of the union leadership and/or members opposed to concessions.
Yes, it may sound 'horrible' but remember this union leadership has demonstrated they'd rather eat their young (so to speak) i.e. 30 layoffs over 2 years for the greater good of the tenured members.
Has any Town Council ever approved the Town Manager's Town budget as submitted to them? Would a single member of the community expect elected officials to simply rubber stamp budgets? The answer is absolutely NOT.
Much credit is deserving of Dr. Greg Florio and Michael Milone for doing their part in developing budgets and directing the towns depts. They are great managers but they have a board of directors. The elected board of directors represents stackholders, you the taxpayers and residents of Cheshire.
When civil society decides we should be rubber stamping budgets without the oversite of elected representitives what will they be willing to give up next?
I'm sorry that some of you are of a mind that the Town Council is at fault for the teachers union making no concessions. That is simply misplaced responsibility.
The teacher's union has stood by this fact; they bargained in good faith and got a three year contract the town agreed to. And you know what, they are accurate in their assessment but a contract award does not guaranty the town can fund everything as is.
Concessions may simply bring about preserving the number of teachers in our schools and since this seems to be the most vocal concern I think all of us would have to agree that a combination of modest tax increases and concessions would go a long way preserving the level of teachers we have now.
I have publically invited (thurs 1/27/11)the union leadership to talk to me, Gerry Brittingham, Dr Florio and any other member of the community they would like to.
My offer stands and I would invite all of you to join me in encouraging this dialogue.
Tim Slocum
"Concessions may simply bring about preserving the number of teachers in our schools and since this seems to be the most vocal concern I think all of us would have to agree that a combination of modest tax increases and concessions would go a long way preserving the level of teachers we have now."
By refusing to consider the rainy day fund as an option that will reduce tax increases and layoffs, you are ignoring a large portion of your constituency and creating a roadblock to compromise. Are you listening to that or is it something that you just don't want to hear?
"I'm sorry that some of you are of a mind that the Town Council is at fault for the teachers union making no concessions. That is simply misplaced responsibility."
I'm sorry that you think this is a one sided problem. Just because you believe that doesn't make it so. The taxpayers are caught in the middle. Compromise requires departure from old beliefs. If you can't do that then retire and let somebody reasonable take your place.
If I'm not mistaken, I believe the rainy day fund is already used in the budgets. Maybe someone on the council can explain exactly how it gets used.
"Yes, it may sound 'horrible' but remember this union leadership has demonstrated they'd rather eat their young (so to speak) i.e. 30 layoffs over 2 years for the greater good of the tenured members."
Rhetoric like this is not helping the process. If you really think the union "wants" layoffs, then compromise is hopeless. If you think that they want to discuss other options besides tax increases then that's a start.
At the end of a budget year there usually is a fund balance / "surplus". One source can be tax revenue which is budgeted at a 99% collection rate but the town usually collects 99.6 or higher. In years past we were actually getting additional and unexpected revenue from the state. Fund balance become operating revenue for the next budget year and thus cushions the impact of a tax increase.
This year the town manager has frozen some capital projects based on some expected short fall in revenues. The same thing took place last year. TC was informed last month that the state funded cheshire 183K less than expected on the personal property exemeption granted local business by state mandate. The state is supposed to fund that difference but we all know the state is up against the wall and similar cuts are likely in many other state funding sources.
The rainy day fund is about 1 months operating revenue for the town. The level has been about 9% for the past few years. The level of these reserves impacts the town's bond rating which reduces the interest rate we pay on our borrowing. It is not walking around money either.
We have become accustomed to the notion of deficit spending for years now with the state and federal gov't but Cheshire has been managed by both Democrat and Republican Councils that have supported keeping our Cheshire's house in sound finacial order. And most of the credit goes to our taxpayers.
The rainy day fund can be reviewed by the TC and this does take place about every 3 years. The last Council supported a 9% level. Last year $600K was used from the fund to support the budget. Cutting into the Rainy day fund is not as wise as it may seem as it is a one time revenue source that makes the following years hole even harder to fill.
When I suggested compromise vis a vis concessions I was not suggesting that TC would not be looking at all sorts of funding opportunities and cost cutting measures.
At the 2/8 meeting of the TC I have asked the budget chairman and Michael Milone to apprise the council and the public of the status rainy day fund. Based on a recent audit just reported we will have the amount of the current fund balance.
Tim Slocum
Thanks, Tim, for clarifying things. People here tend to assume an awful lot when they make statements about the boe & tc and who's going to fund what.
Keep up the good work! I know you have the best interest of the entire community in mind during the budget process.
sz
Tim S, thanks for posting and I hope you continue to post here as you see fit. I don't agree with the criticism that you, nor anybody else on the TC, is preventing the union from negotiating concessions.
I don't think most folks realize that Tim Slocum is part of talks with the union leadership along with Dr. Florio and Gerry Brittingham. I believe Tim has played a very positive role in this team.
While Tim & I may differ on various topics I do respect Tim and know that he's more than fair...certainly more than some folks may want to admit.
In the end...I just want to remind folks that it's not about Tim Slocum, the TC or the BOE. Both of these elected bodies are trying to educate the town about our finances and dire circumstances associated with either increasing or decreasing already tight budgets in this economy in a state with a $3.75B budget deficit.
I hope that folks will put aside their grievances, if only for a moment, to listen in on the upcoming budget meetings between the TC and BOE. I feel that too many of the important details become lost under the cloud of disdain for either of the elected bodies or individuals contained therein.
Getting back on topic here...I posted this thread because we often don't get to hear from the union leadership. As such, I welcome the union leadership to post here as they see fit.
We've begun scheduling meetings with the Finance/Planning committees to analyze areas of reductions and prepare for a $2M reduction in the budget proposal. Layoffs will be on the table.
In short, the boe is not waiting for superman, or superwoman in this case :-) though should he/she arrive it would be greatly appreciated by many in Cheshire.
Thanks,
Tony Perugini
Again, when was the last time the teachers did not get a raise? Just because you don't like the way the TC or Boe or whomever talks does not validate the Union not coming forth with an offer of concession. SOMEONE needs to take the first step, and seeing how generous this Town has been in awarding contracted wage increases year after year, it should be the UNION. Many people who still have jobs in this economy DESERVE as raise, or a larger raise than the 1% or $1 an hour they may have gotten, but most are thankful, for the most part, to still be employed. Someone mentioned that the TC or BOE member(s) are not necessarily listening to their constituents. Well, is the Union leadership listening to theirs? i had conversations with several teachers LAST year who said they were willing to FOREGO raises if it helped to save some of the teaching positions.
I believe every other bargaining unit in this town has made monetary concessions to help out, whether to save fellow workers jobs or reduce the likelihood of layoff. Why is this one the only one that has not? Did the other bargaining units NOT negotiate in good faith? Is it just everyone else who has to pitch in during these budget times but not the teachers?
Honestly, if they don't step up again this year, I hope that our TC and BOE are very diligent and judicious during the next contract negotiations and make sure that there are ZERO increase years and minimal increase years moving forward.
"When I suggested compromise vis a vis concessions I was not suggesting that TC would not be looking at all sorts of funding opportunities and cost cutting measures.
At the 2/8 meeting of the TC I have asked the budget chairman and Michael Milone to apprise the council and the public of the status rainy day fund. Based on a recent audit just reported we will have the amount of the current fund balance." Tim Slocum
So Tim are you saying that you would consider using a reasonable portion of the RDF to fund the BOE budget, because that is real progress if so. There are some on the TC who clearly won't even consider it.
"I believe every other bargaining unit in this town has made monetary concessions to help out"
That is because each of these units negotiated new contracts. Teachers negotiate a new contract this summer.
agreed in 2008 actual
2008 $27,628,012 $27,628,012
2009 $28,843,645 $27,546,647
2010 $30,112,765 $27,646,762
2011 $31,437,727 ??????
Teacher salaries are NOT the problem. By choice, the town has not yet funded ANY of the agreed to salary increases since the teacher contract was negotiated. That is their choice.
If the TC "generously" approved Dr. Florio's budget which includes a $1m increase to teacher salaries for next year, that wouldn't even be what was promised 2 years ago.
Much credit is deserving of Dr. Greg Florio and Michael Milone for doing their part in developing budgets and directing the towns depts. They are great managers
On the "great manager" part, I strongly disagree about MM. It's not just ignoring the issues at the PD and PW for the past few years. Fundamentally, those were personnel issues.
Let's discuss financial issues... supposedly his strength.
Look at the recent arbitration decision that eliminated DB plans for future library union employees. That decision was almost certainly based in part on the "precedent" that had been set when the Council -- against vehement opposition by MM -- voted to direct the TM to eliminate DB plans for future non-union employees.
Eliminating DB plans is the "big picture" stuff. It's not wasting money on some mismanaged PW project.
I'm not saying he's a terrible manager, but "great" is an overstatement IMO. We can do better.
" I don't agree with the criticism that you, nor anybody else on the TC, is preventing the union from negotiating concessions."
Regardless of what Tim or any other TC member says, they had the option last year to provide more funds to the BOE without raising taxes any more than they did and chose not to. If you think that has no bearing on this year you are mistaken. What is the union to assume, that TC will change their tune if concessions happen. Has the TC done anything to change the impasse? As a concerned parent I have been listening and heard nothing from them. The teachers made an offer of a no interest loan last year. Granted it was not what the BOE wanted, but it was still something. This year >100 teachers moved to the HSA to try and save the BOE some benefits costs. Still the rhetoric continues that they have done "nothing".
Compromise is not a one way street.
Listen up Cheshire:
The ink was not even dry on the CUTS to the education budget last year and this TC payed for a special vote (which costs thousands) on a new $7,000,000 pool cover.
It all comes down to PRIORITIES.
http://www.cheshireherald.com/node/2405
http://www.nhregister.com/articles/2010/05/13/news/metro/bb1chpoolpick051310.txt
a state with a $3.75B budget deficit.
It'll $5.0 billion after Gov. Malloy implements honest GAAP accounting... something The Fraudsters in Hartford have been avoiding for years. Thank you Chris Donovan!
And this guy wants to run for Congress?!
No money for education, then over the summer when no one is thinking about underfunded schools:
http://www.cheshireherald.com/node/2908
Tony,
I know that you are not a big fan of stats on "per pupil spending". I know I have read on here somewhere that you believe that spending more may not necessarily improve a students education. Many people would argue that point, but I won't do that now.
I would argue, however, that the numbers here DO, unquestionably support the fact that Cheshire taxpayers are not getting "hosed" on education costs. I think these numbers show they get tremendous value.
Thanks.
http://www.sde.ct.gov/sde/lib/sde/PDF/dgm/report1/basiccon.pdf
"I know that you are not a big fan of stats on "per pupil spending". I know I have read on here somewhere that you believe that spending more may not necessarily improve a students education. Many people would argue that point, but I won't do that now."
The problem I have with the per pupil spending report is how Dr. Florio uses it. The report wasn't meant to rank school districts because every DRG group is unique and ranking them is like comparing apples to oranges and pomengranates. But I feel he uses that report as a crutch to highlight how "little" Cheshire is spending on education to bolster his budget requests. And, it plays on the emotions of those that believe we can't spend enough on students. But...I'm very happy where we 'rank' on that list because spending in the top 15% doesn't prove that more spending equates to better test results. Spending is just one factor. And the ranking is nothing more than download the spreadsheet and sorting from highest-lowest on PPS. Wow.
I DO NOT want to be #1 on that list. Great example of spending considerably on students with poor test results.
I haven't ripped into the per pupil spending yet (it's on my to do list) and I'm waiting for the CEDaR system to be updated with 2009-2010 data on PPS.
I do think the statistic has a useful purpose. I think you posted a partial link as I can't see the report you posted.
Schrumm said the town’s budget would be built around a tax increase that residents could afford and said a 1.7 percent increase could be expected.
this from the record journal
Seems as though boss schrumm has already made up the minds of the 7 members
He knows better than anyone
So input not needed
"The teachers made a good concession offer last year". EXCUSE ME! A loan to be paid back later is a concession? Try that with your boss and he'll laugh in your face before he throws you out.
Over 70% of Cheshires budget is for education. How can people say we don't spend ENOUGH for education? Most of the BOE and TC members have attended or had children in the school system and they still live here. I believe they all are aware of the importance of education. To keep on saying they don't care is false. Call them and talk to them, I'm sure you will be educated.
The reality is that education is always the largest part of any town budget. Where does every resident between 5 and 18 years of age go?
Here are the statistics for Cheshire and its neighboring towns:
education spending as a percent of total spending
Bethany 75.12%
Prospect 72.46%
Southington 67.67%
Wolcott 66.17%
Wallingford 64.42%
Cheshire 64.23%
Meriden 56.19%
Waterbury 45.49%
Hamden 45.08%
The question is: Would Cheshire prefer to associate with the top of the list or the bottom of the list? The Cheshire TC needs to decide.
For the source and more stats, visit:
http://www.cerc.com/TownProfiles/county.asp?county=New_Haven
"Over 70% of Cheshires budget is for education."
Does that include the pool fees that the BOE pays to the TC?
How about the special ed expenses that are not reimbursed to the BOE after the town get them from the state? Does it include those too?
4:41
I hate to say this but I must. You are a dope.
The pool user fees paid by the district is in the Ed budget. I must agree that classifying it as revenue in the pool budget sounds crazy but the pool has a dedicated budget that identifies expenses and revenues...and operates at a loss. (so does the Ed district but who cares about that)
The TC doesn't keep money from the district that is for the district although maybe they should set up an account for "found money" so you can tell them how to spend it.
Did you ever notice that your taxes are paid to the town of Cheshire? They are not paid to the TC or the BOE.
I know you are way too smart to get this and the TC is very coniving and evil but thats the way it is in your cold igloo...or is it a hot air balloon?
"How about the special ed expenses that are not reimbursed to the BOE after the town get them from the state? Does it include those too?"
I believe at next week's TC Audit Committee and Finance/TC Meetings this topic may be addressed. Stay tuned.
Regarding revenue, in general, I'm posting a seperate topic about the budget BOE revenue estimates in the 2011-2012 proposal.
Tony that's separate
Board of Education?
"Did you ever notice that your taxes are paid to the town of Cheshire? They are not paid to the TC or the BOE." I sure as heck did notice. It's hard not to when you read that Cheshire Herald article about where that >$1 million surplus in tax money went (see post above). $450,000 to the medical trust fund, $600,000 to next years budget, $80,000 to the RDF, and $0 to the BOE. Yes, that's right $0. Maybe Schrumm decided that this was a concession by proxy.
"education spending as a percent of total spending
Bethany 75.12%
Prospect 72.46%
Southington 67.67%
Wolcott 66.17%
Wallingford 64.42%
Cheshire 64.23%
Meriden 56.19%
Waterbury 45.49%
Hamden 45.08%
How educational! The only town that has schools close to our quality is Bethany (Amity School District) and they are #1 on the list in spending. This TC would rather that we resemble the bottom 3 in the quality of education. How about the property values and crime to match?
7:34 Did you know that if the Boe has extra money at the end of their budget cycle (like from the salary acct.) that money didn't go back to the town, instead it goes into the medical trust fund account.
The budgets are complicated for most of us to understand (and I've followed them for a while). With all the boe year-end transfers, it's amazing anyone on the boe even knows exactly where the money went.
Creative accounting at its best.
:)
"education spending as a percent of total spending
Bethany 75.12%
Prospect 72.46%
Southington 67.67%
Wolcott 66.17%
Wallingford 64.42%
Cheshire 64.23%
Meriden 56.19%
Waterbury 45.49%
Hamden 45.08%
Here's some towns with good schools:
Southbury 74.39%
Madison 70.10%
Guilford 66.98%
Orange 64.47%
Woodbridge 64.34%
Cheshire 64.23%
All those towns spend more than we do on education? Oh my Dorothy, we're not in Kansas anymore. Better not tell the TC member behind the curtain. He might not grant the BOE more funding.
"Here's some towns with good schools:
Southbury 74.39%
Madison 70.10%
Guilford 66.98%
Orange 64.47%
Woodbridge 64.34%
Cheshire 64.23%"
How do you define a "good school"?
How do you define a "good school"?
Tony: I'm not sure why you are asking, after all you're the one on the BOE. You should know this. You can choose any number of criteria: CMT/CAPT scores, SAT scores, % of students that attend college. Pick any or all of those and all of those schools are "good". Cheshire is comparable to all of those schools and ranks well above every district surrounding it.
If the teachers refuse to make concessions...the loan is not a concession...either are the HSAs...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions? nxt yr isnt going to any better than this yr, probably worse...why are other towns cutting teachers?
"...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions?"
Was last years' TC budget decisions what you call "bending"? From my perspective as a parent and taxpayer, I would call it INSULTING. This TC refuses to listen to parents. We don't want the RDF at 9% and we don't want further layoffs.
"...the loan is not a concession...either are the HSAs...you want the town council to bend even more to try and get them to make concessions? "
No those were not the 0% raise concessions that some on the TC were looking for, but they were an honest effort to help the BOE with a funding gap. Of course, the funding gap for the BOE can be affected greatly by the TC. Last year the TC specifically provided funding to the BOE to cover only increases in transportation and utilities costs. Nothing for salaries. Now the TC is calling on the union to do more to help, but offering nothing but rhetoric in return. Is that really helping the situation?
Tell me what the TC is going to offer other than a tax increase? the town only has so much money, where is it going to come from other than taxes? My children have been in the school system and we notice no decrease in services do to any cuts in the budget. They are avg students taking regular classes and participating in sports/activities. parking has increased and participation fee has increased...why dont we take a collection? When my kid was in Norton we donated funds to help buy Smart boards....maybe when people get up to argue against a leaner budget, we can put a donation table at the mic and you can drop a check/cash in...
Tony,
Have you ever looked at hiring a private company to mow,plow and clean the schools? Alsoo a private firm to run the lunches??? Every time I see a town employee weeding flower beds I can't help but think it is a total waste of money knowing they are making union wages.
FYI There already is a private company that cleans the schools. They used to do it everyday now it's every other day and boy can you see the difference. Yuck.
FYI The lunch program is NOT part of the Boe budget. They're a self supporting program.
Any other ideas??
"Tell me what the TC is going to offer other than a tax increase?"
Have you read any of the other posts? To use part of the oversized rainy day fund!!! That would get us through this year. Next year will be a new contract.
"My children have been in the school system and we notice no decrease in services do to any cuts in the budget."
I don't know what school your children go to, but all of the schools have increased class sizes. Also, there are less course offerings at the high school.
"Have you ever looked at hiring a private company to mow,plow and clean the schools? Alsoo a private firm to run the lunches??? Every time I see a town employee weeding flower beds I can't help but think it is a total waste of money knowing they are making union wages."
Regarding the school lunch programs it subsidized by the feds. There's a subsidy the schools receive for each lunch sold to students. It doesn't hit our operating budget. Capital items such as kitchen equipment and expansion is paid for by Cheshire in the seperate capital budget.
As for maintenance, we can certainly look into private firms however I first want to study the feasibility of combining both Town and BOE maintenance departments. I have to believe we can consolidate the two departments into a shared town service. When I last asked the Superintendent about this, his response was that both he and Town Manager were working on this but Michael Milone put it on the back burner to handle other priorities.
I think that the BOE/Administration should not be focusing on maintenance of our buildings and grounds. I'd like to see a study completed on whether or not it makes sense to combine the two departments once and for all. This may or may not save us money but I have to believe that by centralizing the function on the town side would yield a more efficient operation and a cohesive maintenance strategy for our aging school buildings. That's not to say that either the BOE and Town maintenance operations are not doing a great job but it seems redundant to me.
"maybe when people get up to argue against a leaner budget, we can put a donation table at the mic and you can drop a check/cash in"
I would gladly donate if the TC would agree to use some of the RDF for the BOE. Their insistance that the RDF is only for catastrophes is ridiculous and pompous.
"I don't know what school your children go to, but all of the schools have increased class sizes."
I'm going to chime in on this because I have two daughters at Highland, 1st and 3rd grades and I spend a lot of time at Highland and Dodd. My daughters are not "suffering" from increased class sizes. The classrooms at Highland are not packed to the gills. All of our administrators have done their best to shift teachers around so that those capable can handle larger class sizes, where applicable. Our teachers also benefit from parent volunteers as they see fit. I believe Highland has found a great balance with increased class sizes and support for those classes. Students are not suffering at Highland, the district's largest elementary school.
But...as I've noted here before, physical classroom space is at/near capacity. We can no longer make wholesale classroom consolidations. If classes are increased, we have to be precise about how many students can be placed in the limited classroom space let alone the feasibility of doing so.
Since the start of this school year, the BOE has received zero complaints about class sizes. Not a single parent wrote or contacted the BOE to raise issues about their children "suffering" due to increased class sizes. Prior to the budget meetings, nobody came to committee or BOE meetings to raise issues with classroom sizes. We have not heard from a single teacher, principal or administrator on this matter until this budget process.
And we receive weekly, sometimes daily updates from the administration and all BOE members are keeping an eye on class sizes. To the best of my knowledge, the administration received one complaint from parents about Norton school regarding two classes that increased in size. Working with the administration, Dr. Florio met with those parents at the beginning of the school year to address their concerns. The two classrooms were staffed with teachers more than capable of handling the larger classes.
Now, I'm not stating that no news is good news but rather no news is just that...no news. But if the students are truly "suffering" as a few have indicated then the teachers, principals, administrators and BOE needs to know about it and I encourage those parents who believe their children are indeed suffering from larger classes to contact their principals ASAP and not to wait for budget season to raise the issue.
"Also, there are less course offerings at the high school."
Well, we didn't eliminate electives at CHS last year or the previous year as I recall. So I don't believe fewer course offerings are a result of teacher layoffs since all of the teacher layoffs so far ('09/'10) were done at the elementary and middle schools. I believe we eliminated an advanced language course this year because of the very low enrollment.
Looking at the CHS Master Schedule, there are plenty of course offerings available and it appears there's space available, to some degree, in most of them. What I do notice, however, is a large number of study halls. Study halls are indeed needed for their intended purpose. But I would encourage those students to enroll into additional mathematics, science, reading/literature courses over a study hall if some other course they're interested in is full or no longer available. I have heard from a few students who believe study halls are being used, by some, to pass the time but I hope that's the exception, not the rule.
I'm going to be discussing the CHS Master Schedule here over the next two weeks and I will publish stats on our offerings, class sizes and study halls. Stay tuned.
"Tony: I'm not sure why you are asking, after all you're the one on the BOE. You should know this."
I do but I hear various definitions for "good schools" and they range from course offerings, test results, spending, athletics, class sizes, "quality" of education and property values to name a few.
If basing it on CAPT/CMT test scores, I can tell you that being #1 on the Per Pupil Spending report does not guarantee top scoring on testing. In fact, it would appear to be the opposite.
While I'm glad to see outstanding CAPT/CMT scoring by our school district...I'm not fully convinced those tests are the end all, be all definition of "good schools". I have to consider quality and variety of curriculum offered, graduation and drop-out rates and what I call the "fluff" factor regarding curriculum.
Are some school districts padding their curriculum with "core" courses intended to help students meet minimal credit and graduation requirements but short-changing them on actual content? I consider this "fluff" courses.
Let's take science for example. That State has a mandate on science credits. I think that's wonderful. The first thought that comes to mind is Chemistry, Biology, Physics. But is Zoology considered a true, core science course or simply something that helps students meet a credit? Zoology was raised to me by a few parents which is why I'm using it as an example. Some believe it's a "fluff" course.
While I've been focused on planning/finance so far on the BOE, I've also been looking into curriculum. I will be posting some topics on curriculum soon, specifically mathematics. I'm finding that finding/spending enough time to write up all of the posts I want is challenging but eventually will happen. Be patient. :-)
"My daughters are not "suffering" from increased class sizes. The classrooms at Highland are not packed to the gills."
Tony: Do they have to be packed to th gills in order for us to measure suffering? Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?
Anonymous said...
"maybe when people get up to argue against a leaner budget, we can put a donation table at the mic and you can drop a check/cash in"
I would gladly donate if the TC would agree to use some of the RDF for the BOE.
Money from the RDF is used in the budget. How much should they use for the BOE? And how much are you going to donate?
Tony, you will never win if you have to argue against someone complaining about 21 kids vs 23...to me a significant increase would be 8 to 10 kids...
"Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?"
February 5, 2011 5:16 PM
I agree with 9:34 - 2 more kids is nothing - 10 more, well that's another story.
It's interesting how some here are ripping into the TC. Do they realize last year it was the Boe that cut 1.1 million out of Florio's budget? I don't hear you saying you should vote them all out.
Instead of complaining about class size now(and as Tony said no one complained all year) why don't you come up with some budget saving solutions.
As for maintenance, we can certainly look into private firms however I first want to study the feasibility of combining both Town and BOE maintenance departments. I have to believe we can consolidate the two departments into a shared town service. When I last asked the Superintendent about this, his response was that both he and Town Manager were working on this but Michael Milone put it on the back burner to handle other priorities.
Tony, I think this is a very important point you raise. Here's my take as to what's actually happening...
As I stated a year ago during the campaign, the Council needs to deal with the DPWs failed management. Unfortunately for the taxpayers, the TM refuses to do anything about dealing with this situation... the Council has not taken any substantive action with the TM… and the taxpayers continue getting fleeced through waste and mismanagement. (Look no further than Rosemary Lane.)
Instead of appointing management that could handle your request, MM does his usual "back burner" routine… deny, defer, delay. The TM knows that the current DPW cannot capably handle your request. And so, it becomes a waiting game… waiting until you forget your request.
I assure you that absolutely nothing will change until the BOE – not GF – forcefully pushes on this. But GFs overall relationship with MM is more important to him than this particular issue. So GF will not forcefully push on this. He will not rock the boat on this one… until directed to do so. Then he can go to MM and say the BOE made him do it.
Also, you could talk to Council members about this and try to get them to direct the TM to engage GF. But based on my experience, nothing will change because this issue relates to one of the TMs most “sensitive” personnel situations. MM will pushback on the Council and they won't act.
I suggest a BOE motion directing the Sptd to officially request a deadline for action (with benchmarks) from the TM. Then perhaps the Council will do likewise with the TM. From a policy perspective, that puts you on the record and the ball is in the Council’s court.
The Council may, or may not, get involved. But I wouldn’t let this one slip by and just get ignored indefinitely. The issues related to this request get to the heart of whether the town has capable management… so it will be avoided by the TM at all costs.
But keep this in mind… what’s the endgame? If your goal is to transfer facilities management to the Town, then you should be comfortable with the facilities management team. If you are, that's your opinion. But I’m not comfortable with it. So I suggest simultaneous conversations on:
1) the facilities management team org chart… and
2) who should fill the org chart.
Perhaps with a realigned facilities management team, the org chart will need to change. And things may work out great. Come to think of it… such an idea may spur the Council to action.
Also, you may want to ask GF for MMs “other priorities.” I recall hearing MM publicly state several times that he and GF were working collaboratively to save money through economies of scale. And if that’s true, then this should at least be fairly high on his radar, if not a top priority… right?
Or maybe I’m wrong. But I doubt it. So I encourage you to use your seat at the table to require action is taken in a timely manner. Then let others publicly explain the “other priorities.”
"Or maybe I’m wrong. But I doubt it. So I encourage you to use your seat at the table to require action is taken in a timely manner. Then let others publicly explain the “other priorities.”
Somehow I knew you'd chime in on this :-). I hear you and I will follow through on this.
"It's interesting how some here are ripping into the TC. Do they realize last year it was the Boe that cut 1.1 million out of Florio's budget? I don't hear you saying you should vote them all out."
I heard it last year and had the blog been live last Feb I'm certain there would be many posts against the BOE reduction. During the last budget cycle we were able to identify specific reductions early on in the process. I voted to reduce the budget last year by just under $1M.
However, our options are not so clear cut this time around. Classroom space is at a premium, enrollment is not dropping as quickly as projected and we have contractual/mandated obligations to meet. Reductions must be precise and yes it's that tight and deserves proper due diligence.
The BOE finance committee is meeting on a regular basis between now and June to review specific areas of reduction. Next week (I'll post the meeting reminder tomorrow) the BOE Finance Committee is meeting to discuss costs associated with extra-curricular activities. It's very possible we may see a full pay to play participation fee. With almost $1M being directed to extra-curricular activities, it's one area we're closely studying.
While the BOE was not able to make specific budget reduction recommendations last month...we will be making recommendations soon. It's not over for the BOE by any means.
People have been thanking me for passing Dr. Florio's budget (some are folks that chastized me for reducing it last year) I've asked them NOT to thank me because we will be making precise reduction recommendation soon, not arbitrary ones. I have to balance what I believe are the needs of the school district with fiscal responsibility. Some folks understand this, some don't.
Had the BOE been able to identify reductions to the budget, I'm certain we would have heard the complaints and 'bashing' that the TC seems to be receiving. I'm certain we will come this May.
What's being lost in the 'bashing' are the fiscal issues we're having both at the local and state levels as well as the looming reduction in grant money to Cheshire. The problems don't end with this current budget process be it hitting the rainy day fund and/or raising taxes. We will be in a similar situation next year, perhaps a less-dire situation if we can work out a concession with the teacher's union.
Don't bash the TC or the BOE, it's not going to solve for root cause, IMO.
"Tony: Do they have to be packed to th gills in order for us to measure suffering? Do we really want 23 kids vs. 21 kids per class. It automatically means that they are receiving less teacher attention. I'm glad that you feel that your children are not suffering...yet, but aren't we heading in the wrong direction (thanks to this TC)?"
Are we headed in the wrong direction? Yes. I agree with you that one-on-one face time between teacher/student will decrease as class sizes grow. But that also depends on the makeup of the students in a class. Some require more attention than others and vice-versa. There are ways to offset that (naturally, by lowering class sizes) but also by provding help to the teachers. Be it IAT's or TA's and/or altering the curriculum to allow for more one-one time with students. Or, gasp, investment in technology to aid with curriculum delivery and student learning.
I do believe, however, that as our enrollment drops significantly over the next 5 years, we may see 'normal' class sizes again.
I disagree with you that it's this town council's fault for the wrong direction. Now, just because I'm an (R) and the majority on the TC is (R) doesn't mean I'm defending my 'kind' for the sake of politics. We don't always see eye to eye and I can be a giant pain in the rear to my fellow colleagues. But I don't believe anyone on the TC is anti-education and is not listening to the BOE, you or Dr. Florio or purposely leading us in the wrong direction on education.
What about the last TC? Or the prior one? Or the last 2,3 or 4 BOE's? What about our economic climate? $3.5B state deficit and $400M ECS shortfall? Sky rocketing health care costs and contractual obligations straining our wallets in this economy? Unemployment? Old school buildings whereby we invest millions of capital dollars every year for upkeep?
The list of "who's to blame" factors are extensive but I don't think it's fair to blame this particular TC. I think they've inherited an awful economy and are trying to navigate us through it.
And...Cheshire is certainly not alone in reducing budget requests including education. Every school district is facing the same similar issues as Cheshire but I believe we're much better off than most of them and can make our budget work to meet the needs of our school district.
Thanks Tony. I know your goal is to save money for the taxpayers. And many elected / appointed officials share your goal. The problem is that saving money is not necessarily the top priority for others.
IMO that's one of the most important things you can do as an elected official... learn what motivates other decisionmakers... not what they publicly state motivates them... but what actually motivates them. Such knowledge can greatly expedite the legislative process.
"I would gladly donate if the TC would agree to use some of the RDF for the BOE.
Money from the RDF is used in the budget. How much should they use for the BOE? And how much are you going to donate?" The TC and the TM have not done the budget yet.
If the TC will use $1 million from the RDF for the BOE, I will donate $1000. With 30,000 residents, that would cover about 30 people or 10 families of 3. You can use the money to subsidize taxes for low income residents.
"During the last budget cycle we were able to identify specific reductions early on in the process. I voted to reduce the budget last year by just under $1M."
Was the thought that this would avoid further reductions? It did not work out that way. This TC cut even further, hence the bashing.
"But I don't believe anyone on the TC is anti-education and is not listening to the BOE, you or Dr. Florio or purposely leading us in the wrong direction on education."
You may believe that Tony, but their actions speak volumes to the contrary. There are a lot of people who were very dissappointed in the TC budget decisions last year and in where they appear to be leaning this year. They are hurting the town in the long run in the name of what they think is "fiscal responsibility", but is really reactionary short-sighted thinking.
As a point of reference, as someone who has "negotiated"
with the town. This is how it occurs... The personnel manager walks in, says this (lets say 2%) is what you have to work with. figure out what you want to add and give back, but thats it(not much of a negotaiation more of a dictation). THis goes back and forth, then mediation or arbitration goes on. The Town fails to compare themselves to like towns, chosing to compare to less affluent towns to better make thier case(as opposed to when they compare adminstator salaries. The mediator hands down a "fair" award then the TC complains, failing to recognize that mediated/arbitrated awards normally favor the municipality. They fail to vote thus invoking the award or a close vote is taken to have an appearance of due dilligence. Then Schrumm complains about arbitrations and Sima votes no to a favorable award. Employees unhappy, taxpayers unhappy, Cheshire becomes poorer (not financially, but standard of living). The town still posts surplus every year (1/2 mil each of last 2, 2 mil for each of previous 3 years) penny wise pound foolish
Tony, is it true that the teachers have called for a special meeting with the leadership to dicuss concessions? I have heard from a from a few teachers that most members are fed up with the executive board and want to offer concessions. If this meeting is happening, is it open to the public?
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